hi there! what’s problematic about the phrase “women and femmes”? a lot of queer-identified folks i know use it a lot when referring to patriachial oppression, and at first it made sense to me but now i’m not so sure it does. thanks!!

gothhabiba:

femme is a specific identity that arose in a particular context within working-class communities in the 1930s & 40s centered around dating & having sex with other women & it’s silly to use it as a catch-all term for “feminine” (although I recognise that saying this is fighting a losing battle, lmao).

using “femme” to vaguely mean “feminine / feminine-presenting people” is 1. to misappropriate that terminology and 2. (and more importantly at this point imho) to imply that femininity or feminine presentation are hallmarks of “real” women, as positioned against gender nonconforming & butch women (who are decried for being “masculine” and therefore basically men). holding up “femininity” as a prerequisite for womanhood is, besides being flat-out misogynistic, always going to exclude and demonise lesbians (because even femmes aren’t acceptably feminine & are gender nonconforming in many aspects of their behaviour), & especially butches.

i’m almost certain this is a corruption of “women and trans femmes” or “trans women and femmes” where someone skipped over any mention of transness and it caught on because like. the original term is to include nonbinary trans people who aren’t women but are impacted by transmisogyny. and the term that’s caught on doesn’t really contain a group that has stuff in common