this is actually really really informative thank you !

earthmoonlotus:

autismserenity:

Like do people not understand that, if nothing else, when you use TERF arguments on another group, you are strengthening TERFs?? Because when people who agree with you stumble across TERF logic, it’s going to seem reasonable and familiar to them? It’s going to just be building on premises they’ve already accepted?

some examples: “you cannot identify/opt out of privilege” (further reading), “there is an invasion of oppressors coming into our community claiming to be oppressed members of it and They Are The Enemy” (further reading) (especially when you consider that they put as much, if not more energy into attacking those who they perceive as “invaders” as they do against the actual oppressors in question, and they receive hardly any if any backlash from the actual oppressors in question for doing so; if the “invaders” really were members of the oppressor class, you’d think actual members of the oppressor class would get mad at you for attacking the “invaders”, but they hardly ever do, if ever), “all oppression [insert group of people] claims to face is actually misdirected homophobia/misogyny” (including the specific idea that biphobia isn’t real and it’s just homophobia/lesbophobia), “People only have [insert identity/ies] because of internalized homophobia”, mocking/slandering inclusionists as liberals who don’t understand radical anti-oppression theory and class analysis (further reading), especially using the word “kweer” to mock queer people they disagree with, being against the use of the word “queer”, “You just hate lesbians!!!!” (and presuming that it’s necessary to hold their viewpoint in order to be a lesbian / that their viewpoint is the default and/or should be the default for lesbians), identifying with the term “gatekeeper”, claiming that “terf” is a silencing tactic (further reading), claiming that no-platforming is a silencing tactic, claiming that invalidation of personal identity is meaningless (this specifically enables the idea that misgendering isn’t violent), bonding with right-wingers over hate against people who disagree with you / using arguments originally used by right-wingers, etc.

Keep in mind that this rhetoric is so similar that TERFs have noticed this and used it to their advantage. (source 1, source 2, source 3, source 4, source 5)

Also keep in mind that, while there may be one or two terfs who favor ace inclusion, there are hundreds who are against it. That shouldn’t be a good sign. And non-TERF inclusionists have in the past shown more sympathy towards TERFs than they do towards ace people. (example 1, example 2, example 3, example 4, example 5)

This doesn’t make all ace-exclusionists TERFs, but as the OP was saying, it makes them enablers of TERFs, which is a form of transmisogyny. Also note that, unless you yourself are a trans woman / transfeminine person, you can’t say “but there are trans women on our side!!!” as a way to argue against this, because that’s basically using the “my trans friend agrees with me!!!” argument. You can’t use that as an excuse to say something’s ok when trans women are saying it actively puts them and their sisters in danger.