women perpetuate just as much violence against trans women as men do. if u dont think terfs and their ideology harm trans women then you and i arent seeing the same thing
mod bird
“we don’t attack trans women we only justify and normalise it”
I’ve seen some TERFs in the past saying shit like “if you don’t want us reblogging your posts, don’t post things we might like” and similar sentiments that disregard the boundaries of people who don’t want their posts reblogged by TERFs. That would be super messed up in and of itself, but wanna know what makes it even more messed up? The fact that TERFs often claim that their whole movement is about boundaries.
They claim that they’re TERFs because they care about the boundaries of “””females””” (by which they mean cis women and other afab people) who don’t want to be around “””males””” (by which they mean trans women). They claim they’re TERFs because they care about the boundaries of (cis) lesbians who don’t like penises, because according to their narrative, trans activists want to force all cis lesbians to interact with penises. On top of this ridiculous nonsense, they put some legitimate feminist boundary-related concerns into their narrative (such as pregnant people’s legitimate need for bodily autonomy and boundaries relating to their own bodies, and the need to end rape culture and protect women’s boundaries regarding sexual consent), but spin these concerns to make it seem like trans women somehow perpetuate and benefit from the current system that fights against these needs. Many times, I’ve seen TERFs essentially claim that the purpose of their movement is to fight to enforce women’s boundaries. (And by “women” they mean afab people.)
And yet, the fact that they completely, shamelessly ignore the boundaries of many tumblr users (most of whom are “””female””” by TERFs’ standards) who explicitly state that they don’t want TERFs interacting with their posts shows that they don’t really care about boundaries as much as they might like to think they do. They only care about them when it suits their agendas, or when they can spin it to suit their agendas. They claim that boundaries are the most important thing in the world when they can make it seem like trans women’s existence violates them, but they completely ignore explicitly-stated boundaries when they feel like doing it, claiming that it doesn’t really matter.
terfs have picked up the rhetoric that the AIDS crisis was /The/ defining moment for the community, and that’s why there’s absolutely no room for ace or aro people in the LGB community, because they weren’t at risk. let that sink in for a moment. The LGB community.
they’re erasing the fact trans women, most especially trans women of colour and sex workers, are still the highest-risk group for HIV.
i’m done. TWERFs can die. SWERFs who want to eradicate sex work before eradicating poverty can die. Ace ‘exclusionists’ giving them more ideas on how to exclude trans women can delete your shit sideblogs now and think real hard about what you’re doing, thanks
Also, a short list of reasons TERFs absolutely love reframing LGBT as SGA:
– it’s framing bi and pan people as a burden on the resources of the True SGAs. – It frames bi people’s belonging as conditional, they can belong so long as they’re not dating the opposite gender. – This is what TERFs have been trying to do to bi women forever, framing all sex with men as rape and bi women as gullible idiots who need to become a Properly Gay for their own safety – it’s framing trans people as hitching a ride onto the SGA community. – it’s framing straight trans people as the Privileged Invaders. – It erases the sexualities of nonbinary people without same or similar genders, because they mustn’t really exist, right. if anything, they’re anomalies who don’t really belong.
Reframing the root cause of our oppression as SGA, instead of our /actual identities as an oppressed class/, is completely in line with what TERFs have been doing since the 70s, you gullible fucks. you can write ‘No TERFs’ on your blog as much as you like but it doesn’t stop them reblogging your posts. You need to block each one on sight. TERF blogs are still full of your rhetoric. Stop feeding the monsters.
if TERFs have reblogged your aphobe posts, message them to delete it, publically call them out, spam them, shame them. and if you feel the need to write more posts about excluding aces, think ‘could this idea also be used against trans women, bi people or nonbinary people?’ because it usually will.
This isn’t some kind of liberal you’re dealing with
who is operating under denial and tries to be a decent person to some level at least.
These people are on the same level as westboro baptist churchers. They want trans women eradicated. Destroyed. Literally “morally mandated out of existence” (as Janice Raymond wrote).
They want us dead.
They can not be reasoned with. They can’t be convinced. They can’t be made to see reality. They will, even if you attempt gentle communication, work to hurt you. They will work to abuse you. They will work to do as much harm as possible in the hopes that they can either cow you to their genocidal viewpoint or harm you enough to defend yourself so they can claim you were a “violent dangerous male”.
The only purpose for communicating with a terf is to tear apart their rhetoric for others to see. Make it clear that they’re wrong to others. You’re not here to convince them. It’s not worth the cost of trauma to you.
Seriously, it’s not worth it. Don’t expose yourself to it. If you have to engage, do it swiftly, rip their crap apart and then block and move on. They are out to hurt you. And enough of us die every day, enough of us suffer every day, for any of us to go into hell willingly.
Please just don’t do it.
Terfs are, and very often ally with, fascists and white supremacists. They’re just another face of fascism.
When you started letting non-same sex attracted trans people in.
You caused homophobia within the community to spike.
Trans people calling women, who are oppressed for their gender “cis”. A word that means “Not oppressed by gender”.
Caused trans people to think it was okay to force themselves on lesbians/gay men and call them “transphobic” if they wouldn’t have sex with you because you have a dick/vulva.
Let trans people trample over LGB issues like marriage equality, corrective rape, and the criminalization of gay sex.
Let trans people redefine gay and lesbian sex, calling lesbian’s attraction to vuvlas a “genital fetish”.
Made everything have to be “inclusive” for every possible gender anyone could possibly think they were and let straight people identify as “bisexual” because they might date a nonbinary person.
Made womyn exlusive issues surrounding their anatomy no longer (liberal)feminist because “SOME MEN DEAL WITH THAT!!!!”
Prioritized non-same sex attracted trans people over actual LGB people
And this is what made ace people think they could step all over us as well.
Homophobia in the community spiked, once again
Ace people calling LGB people, who are oppressed for their attraction “allo”. A word that means “Not oppressed by attraction”.
Caused ace people to think it was okay to pressure people into relationships. If you say no because sex is important to you, you’re “aphobic”
Let ace people trample over LGB issues like marriage equality, corrective rape, and the criminalization of gay sex.
Let ace people redefine what homosexual and bisexual mean to “experiences sexual attraction to ______”. Calls anyone who doesn’t agree an “aphobe”
Made everything “inclusive” for every possible a-spec identity anyone could possibly thing they are
Made LGB issues surrounding sex and relationships welcome because “PDA IS GROSS!!!!”
Prioritizes non-same sex attracted ace people over actual LGB people.
IF YOU STILL CAN’T SEE HOW SIMILAR THESE ARE, YOU’RE THE REASON ACE PEOPLE WANT IN.
So there are TERFs and SWERFs out there now who are claiming
Stormé DeLarverie as ‘their’ Stonewall heritage because she identified as a butch lesbian and to those TERFs and SWERFs I just want to say: FUCK YOU.
Stormé DeLarverie was an african american gender nonconforming butch lesian and a hero and she was no fucking TERF or SWERF.
Stormé was a regular at the Stonewall where the majority of the visitors were trans, the majority was people of color and the majority was involved in some kind of sex work. This was the community she was part of, these were many of her friends, these were the people she protected. After Stonewall she continues to work at and frequent bars that put up drag shows and provided safe spaces for transgender people. As a gender nonconforming person she stood in solidarity with transgender people and queer sex workers and frequently risked her life for them.
It is typical that TERFs and SWERFs are trying to do this 3 years after her death because if you all did this while she was alive she would have told you to fuck off before she could get her baseball bat. How dare you shit on everything she stood for.
Fuck you for trying to tarnish her memory with your hate.
can y’all fellow tme trans folks Quit acting like transmascs and tme nbs are Incapable of being terfs and being compared to terfs is thus an act of Terrible Transphobia like newsflash asshole there’s tons of nb and trans guy terfs. terfs will take you if you’re afab and willing to beat down your trans sisters. if you use terf rhetoric you can bet your ass you’re gonna get called out on using terf rhetoric. you can’t use your transness as a shield when there’s dozens of trans guy and nb terfs that are eager to sacrifice their gender for radfem approval. y’all are boring and think you’re incapable of falling prey to terf rhetoric just because you’re trans. you’re not. next.
I’ve seen nb truscum who say their own gender is “just a mental illness and not real.”
Literally nothing about your identity hinders you from being a bigot. If the form of bigotry you’re being accused of is particularly targeted towards a group you’re exempt from (trans women,) you’ve ESPECIALLY got no place denying it, even if you’re part of a broader group that gets generally targeted (trans/nb people.) You have privilege over trans women if you’re not one, and if you get called out for endangering them or supporting their aggressor’s, its not your damn place to discredit those accusations on the basis of your identity. Bull fucking shit.
radical feminism, 1973: one is not born a woman trans women: hi radical feminism, 1979: jesus god not like that
god y’all are so obtuse, this isn’t what de beauvoir meant in the slightest. she meant ‘women are shaped into their social role through upbringing and socialisation’ not ‘women make a conscious choice to behave like their designated social role’. if anything this disproves trans ideology and the whole ‘i’m a woman inside’ argument as it states that passive interactions throughout your lifetime shape your womanhood, not some kind of innate emotional feeling. read a book.
hi i’ve read the entirety of the second sex and you’re very wrong
wait are you disagreeing with me or op i’m so confused
with op!!! sorry lmao definitely with the op. i hate how that quote keeps getting taken out of context
oh good lol
i’ve also studied the second sex extensively, and beauvoir is unambiguously referring to socialization. sorry OP
do yall realize youre literally making my points for me and the saying the exact same things as just about every vein of contemporary trans theory since at least, like, the mid nineties or are u just being…obtuse
i don’t possibly see how any of this is making your points for you. your original post seemed to suggest that the ideology of transwomen is totally consistent with feminist ideas (such as beauvoir’s), and their ideology is not consistent with feminist ideas at all.
With “no one is born a woman” she was referring exactly to GENDER, to socialization, not sex. Stop lying about the meaning of that quote for your own interests.And, for you, aren’t transwomen born women?
no. every contemporary account of gender created by trans women in the outsider theory community–the only place we’re actually welcome–holds that gender is a fully social process. whether you want to look at material feminism, trans material feminism specifically, trans lesbian feminism, trans separatism, or gender nihilism (a school of thought from outsider theorists that has actually, like, been taught at multiple gender studies departments), every last one of them treats gender as socialized (since, like, 1994)–which you would know if you bothered to engage with trans women versed in theory and hadn’t gathered all your information about our alleged self-conception from buzzfeed articles and pop liberalism’s approach to transness.
moreover, if you’d actually read the work from de beauvoir, you’d remember that the first thing she writes in that chapter of the second sex is this:
[B]elief…in a ‘prehistory’ when women created civilization (because of a biological predisposition) while the coarse and brutal men hunted (because of a biological predisposition) is symmetrical with the biologizing interpretation of history produced now by the class of men….Furthermore, not only is this conception still imprisoned in the categories of sex (woman and man), but it holds onto the idea that the capacity to give birth (biology) is what defines a woman…By doing this…[n]ot only to we naturalize history, but also consequently we naturalize the social phenomena which express our oppression, making change impossible.
from its inception, the party line of the second wave was that hearkening to essentialist accounts of dimorphic, inherent, mutually antithetical sex reproduces the conditions of women’s oppression. it was only in the late seventies–after the stonewall riots had sparked a huge surge of radical gay and trans activism throughout the decade, after biomedical transition had become a widespread possibility for the first time since the 30s, and after the benjamin standards (the product of a white, heterosexual man and not the vulnerable trans people forced to navigate them in order to receive healthcare) were first published–that radical feminism finally made its mythopoetic appeal to sex essentialism. y’all were so desperate to swerve around us that you inverted one of the core tenets of the second wave and absolutely shattered the feminist movement in the process.
lesbian feminism, central to the second wave up through the early seventies with wittig’s le corps lesbien, was forced into its own vein by the panic around “male alignment” y’all created that disenfranchised gnc women–ultimately precipitating the separatist ethos of the 80s. mythopoetic cultural feminism split from post-structural feminism and started an ideological war that persists to this day. the third wave was finally able to regain some ground when crenshaw introduced intersectionality in 89 and marxist feminism started gaining a broader platform–but y’alls legacy is setting the feminist movement back by at least two decades, splintering a 30+ year old party line into fragments which have still not been reunified, and jeopardizing the healthcare, political rights, social situation, and physical safety of generations of trans women–all because you couldn’t be bothered to understand that your (totally justified! we’re totally with you on this!) objections to the benjaminian concept of transness were the product of a straight white male practitioner and not the generation of trans women his antifeminist, antigay medicalized hoopjumping left traumatized.
Mate, you’re just trying to get me confused.I read the book, I know what she meant, she didn’t made a book focused on women’s social role and women’s oppression as some sort of proof that biological sex doesn’t exist.
Intersectionality is about the intersection of misogyny and racism, NOTHING to do with males.
Your far-fetched language essay is making it very difficult to get your point.Is that your intention? Throwing a bunch of disconected and questionable information around won’t change the fact that the only definiton for woman is human female and that women and men receive different socialization and are given different social roles because of their sex, it is the factual truth.Her point is that women aren’t born feminine, docile, submissive, they are taught to be that way, and if a male presents that way it doesn’t mean he’s a woman.That’s it.
Feminism is and will always be about females, because women are oppressed on the basis of being female, not over some ridiculous concept of gender people identify in and out.Patriarchy is about males oppressing females for our reproductive and sexual possibility to sustain a economic system that is based on heirs and a large working class.
Make your opinion more compact.I’m not willing to read a full bullshit essay.
mate. here is a sparknotes version:
(a) you’re being ahistorical;
(b) your concept of trans women originated with a straight white heterosexual male endocrinologist and his work in the 70s, not from us;
(c-i) your concept of trans women pits the full weight of academia against the self-descriptions of poor, older, mostly nonwhite trans women who have never had the privilege and luxury of stepping foot in a gender studies department;
(c-ii) you haven’t read the work of any trans theorists;
(d) the third wave, initiated by crenshaw, re-shifted focus onto nonwhite, gay, and eventually trans women–something y’all had never thought to do;
(e) you’re apparently unwilling to read so much as 4 paragraphs explaining why (see a) you’re being ahistorical and (see c) your ideology is irrelevant to contemporary trans theory;
(f) you need to remove your head from whatever orifice you’ve currently got it lodged in, generally;
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